Mr. Paine.

also, getting rid of the old rugs for the same purpose, and I thought it was in the fall, but I can't place when it was.

Mr. Liebeler.

In the fall of 1963?

Mr. Paine.

Yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you say the curtain rods are still in the garage?

Mr. Paine.

Yes, I think so.

Mr. Liebeler.

Approximately how long are they?

Mr. Paine.

Well, I think this is, when they expand, I guess the curtain rods themselves are 32 1/2 inches to 3 feet, but the two of them slide together to make a pair, this expanding type just of rod metal.

Mr. Liebeler.

Approximately how long are they, would you say, when they are fitted together and in their collapsed state or their----

Mr. Paine.

As I say, those came out of house or she would not have, I was trying to think of some of the paper she might have had that resembles this, but the thing she bought new would be the shades, the window shades to go in place of those curtain rods.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember seeing any paper in the garage that might have been a package in which those shades came?

Mr. Paine.

No, I don't recall any.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did you ever have a conversation with your wife about these curtain rods in connection with the assassination?

Mr. Paine.

No. I think we did both read that he had said he was, to Frazier, that he was carrying, maybe it was curtain rods or something to do with windows in my mind.

Mr. Liebeler.

But your wife didn't mention to you that Oswald ever mentioned to her anything about the curtains rods?

Mr. Liebeler.

Now, place yourself in the garage on or about November 21, 22, 1963, or shortly before that time, and tell me everything that you can remember as being in that garage.

Mr. Paine.

Well, there is a bench along, in front of, a fiberglass window panel. That bench is generally covered with boxes, there are boxes underneath that bench. On the end of the bench is a drill press. My recollection is confused by the fact I am much more familiar with it now that I have moved back and I have moved my stuff into that garage, so it is fuzzy in my memory.

Mr. Liebeler.

Were you present on November 22 when the police or the FBI or any other authorities searched the garage?

Mr. Paine.

No, I wasn't.

Mr. Liebeler.

What time did you get to the Irving house on the 22d?

Mr. Paine.

I think just about 3 o'clock.

Mr. Liebeler.

3 o'clock on Friday afternoon?

Mr. Paine.

Yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

What were the circumstances under which you first heard of the assassination on that day?

Mr. Paine.

I was eating lunch in the bowling alley, and the waitress came and told me. I thought she was joking, and we went and listened to somebody's transistor, and then I went back to the lab.

Mr. Liebeler.

At that time you had heard only that the President had been shot, is that correct?

Mr. Paine.

Yes, that is correct.

Mr. Liebeler.

There was no connection with Oswald?

Mr. Paine.

That is correct.

Mr. Liebeler.

And the assassination at that time?

Mr. Paine.

That is right. Went back to the lab and then----

Mr. Liebeler.

Before you get back to the lab let me ask you this, who was with you at the first time you heard the assassination?

Mr. Paine.

Dave Noel.

Mr. Liebeler.

Was Mr. Krystinik with you?

Mr. Paine.

No.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did you hear during this first period of time when you first heard of the assassination, that the President had been shot near the Texas School Book Depository?