(Testimony of J. W. Fritz)
Mr. Fritz.
for a decoy, and I will have a squad to lead it up to the central expressway and across to the left on Elm Street and the money wagon can turn down Elm Street and you can turn down Main Street, when you get to Main Street, going to the county jail," and he told me he and Chief Stevenson would meet me at the county jail, that is when we started out.
Mr. Ball.
How would you have done it if you were going to do it?
Mr. Fritz.
Well, I hesitate to say because it didn't work good this way. If I had done it like I would do it or usually do it or something and it hadn't worked I would be just in the same. shape you know, and it would be just as bad, so I don't like to be critical of something because it turned out real bad.
You can kind of understand my--I know that our chief didn't know anything was going to happen or he surely wouldn't have told me to transfer it that way.
Mr. Ball.
How would you have done it?
Mr. Fritz.
Well, we transferred Ruby the next day at about the same time, and I had two of the officers from my office to pick me up away from the office. We drove by the county jail, saw that the driveway was open. We had about the same threats on him that we did with Oswald. We saw that the driveway was open. I went back to the bus station and I called one of my officers upstairs, gave him the names of two other officers, told him to get those two officers and not tell anyone even in the office where they were going, mark Ruby transferred temporarily, which means coming to the office or going for some fingerprints or anything, mark him transferred temporarily, bring him down to the jail elevator at the bottom of the jail, put two of them to stay in the jail elevator with him. For the other one to come to the outside door and when he saw our car flush with the door, bring that man right through those cameras and put him in the back seat, and they did, they shot him right through those people and they didn't even get pictures and we had him lie down on the back seat and two officers lean back over him and we drove him straight up that same street. turned to the left down Main Street, ran him into the jail entrance, didn't even tell the jailer we were coming and put him in the jail. It worked all right.
But now if it hadn't worked, you know, I don't want to be saying that I know more about transferring than someone else, because this could happen to me. I could see if it happened to Ruby, I would have had all the blame.
Mr. Ball.
Now, if on that morning at 11:15 you planned to transfer him, didn't you, according to the chief's orders?
Mr. Fritz.
Yes, sir; I did.
Mr. Ball.
And you were through questioning him, weren't you?
Mr. Fritz.
Sir?
Mr. Ball.
You were all through questioning him?
Mr. Fritz.
Yes, sir; we had everything that we could do at that time. I would have talked to him later in the county jail but we didn't need to hold the man any longer.
Mr. Ball.
Had he been handcuffed?
Mr. Fritz.
Yes, sir; and I told--he was already handcuffed, and I told one of the officers to handcuff his left hand to Oswald's right hand, and to keep him right with him.
Mr. Ball.
That was Leavelle?
Mr. Fritz.
Leavelle, yes, sir. He first started the other hand on the other side, and I told Officer Graves to get on the other side and Montgomery to follow him, and I would go down and an officer by the name of Swain who works across the hall from us came over and offered to help us, he went down the jail elevator and he went out ahead of me and I went out in back of him and I was approaching our car to open the back door to put him in, they were having a terrible time to get the car in through the people---they were crowding all over the car---and I heard the shot and I turned just in time to see the officers push Ruby to the pavement.
Mr. Ball.
When you came out of the jail door were the lights on?
Mr. Fritz.
Yes, sir; the lights were on. I don't believe they were on as we came to the door, but they came out immediately as we were coming out of the door, and I asked one of the officers, two of them answered me if everything was secure and they said everything was all right. So we came out.
Mr. Ball.
What about the lights?
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