They took my wife and I to a back room and shut us off completely from the reporters and everyone. There was no one in that room for 4 hours but this sheriff and a FBI agent, Agent Sorrels, and a stenographer, and I think another lady and a man that had seen another man carrying a rifle in a case on the other end of town earlier prior to this time.
Mr. Specter.
Are you sure there was a court reporter present?
Mr. Rowland.
It was one of the secretaries from the office of the sheriff, stenographer who was taking, using an electric typewriter every time.
Mr. Specter.
Was she taking down in shorthand--
Mr. Rowland.
Yes.
Mr. Specter.
As you could observe--
Mr. Rowland.
Yes.
Mr. Specter.
Each word that you were saying?
Mr. Rowland.
Yes.
Mr. Specter.
Did she have any sort of a machine, such as a stenograph, as the gentleman who is serving as court reporter has?
Mr. Rowland.
No; she took it down in shorthand and retyped it on an electric typewriter that she brought into the room.
Mr. Specter.
Did she type up what you had said?
Mr. Rowland.
Yes; typed up three or four copies and then I signed it at that time.
Mr. Specter.
I now show you a photostatic copy of what purports to be an affidavit which you gave to the Sheriff's Department of the County of Dallas, Tex., on November 22, 1963, and has been marked as Commission Exhibit No. 357. Would you take a look at that, take your time, of course, and tell us whether or not that is the affidavit which you took on the occasion which you have just related?
Mr. Rowland.
Yes. In fact, at this time I also noted that my wife dragged me across the street.
Mr. Specter.
Just one detail on that statement: There is a reference here to the man holding the rifle being in a position which you describe as "a parade-rest sort of position." That appears--
Mr. Rowland.
It does appear in there?
Mr. Specter.
Eighteen lines down.
Mr. Rowland.
Yes; I see it. It wasn't a parade-rest position. It was a port-arms position. I never noticed that in there before. There were--actually, I will say this, I said what I had to say. The FBI agent reworded it, and she took it down.
Now this happened; it wasn't my words verbatim, it was reworded.
Mr. Specter.
Did you ever use the words "parade-rest" position?
Mr. Rowland.
Not to my recollection.
Mr. Specter.
So it is just an error in transcription which you did not notice. when you signed it.
(At this point, Chief Justice Warren entered the hearing room.)
Is there any other aspect of the affidavit which you gave, which you have just observed, which is at variance with your current recollection of what you saw and heard on that date?
Mr. Rowland.
Here it states we were at the west entrance of the sheriff's office, that is just a general approximation, we were 25 feet from there, in fact.
Mr. Specter.
Are there any other portions of it which vary from your current recollection?
Mr. Rowland.
I don't remember saying definitely that he was back about 15 feet. In fact, I think I said, as I said now, 3 to 5 feet, because from my point of view if he was back 15 feet I couldn't have even seen him.
Mr. Specter.
Are there any other parts of the affidavit which vary from your current recollection?
Mr. Rowland.
The actual time between the reports I would say now, after having had time to consider the 6 seconds between the first and second report and two between the second and third. It is very fast for a bolt-loading rifle.
