Mr. Hubert.

I am talking about the other man.

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes; seems to me a dark suit, but everybody was wearing dark suits.

Mr. Hubert.

Did he have a hat on ?

Mr. Jenkins.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

But you don't know who that was?

Mr. Jenkins.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

How close to the elevator shaft was Ruby and the other man?

Mr. Jenkins.

Well, they were along the wall near, I believe, the women's restroom, about halfway from the elevator door to the corridor, to the cross corridor I mean. I would say probably about 7 feet, maybe.

Mr. Hubert.

Was any policeman at that time guarding or checking identification at the elevator door or at the staircase?

Mr. Jenkins.

No; not to my recollection. Of course I didn't go down.

Mr. Hubert.

I mean when you saw Ruby talking to this other man or the man you believe to be talking to the other man, were there also policemen there?

Mr. Jenkins.

Not in that immediate vicinity. Not that I recall; no.

Mr. Hubert.

Was that the only time you saw him at the early part of the afternoon?

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes; that's right. At the moment, I was on the way down to the snackbar to get a cup of coffee.

Mr. Hubert.

Would that help you fix the time?

Mr. Jenkins.

I don't think so; not exactly.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you have any supper that night?

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes; I did. I had a hamburger. I had a cold one. It was left over from somewhere. Quite a few had been brought up, I think, and I was with Lieutenant May of the auto theft department, and he offered me a hamburger. This was considerably later. I would say probably 10 or 11 o'clock, I don't know. And he offered me a hamburger, and it was left over, and I took it.

Mr. Hubert.

Where was the snackbar?

Mr. Jenkins.

It is as you go up into the third floor, go toward the Chief's office and the dispatch office.

Mr. Hubert.

You didn't have to leave the floor ?

Mr. Jenkins.

No; in fact, it was right beside that intersection which I have been telling you about.

Mr. Hubert.

When you came back from getting the coffee, did you observe Ruby there?

Mr. Jenkins.

I didn't look. I went straight back through. I was going back to talk to my colleagues to see if there was anything else they found out.

Mr. Hubert.

Do you recall whether you had more than one cup of coffee that day?

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes; considerably more than one cup.

Mr. Hubert.

Was it dark when you saw him, do you know? Dark outside?

Mr. Jenkins.

I couldn't say. There was not a window in the area. I could not tie that in with any part of the observation.

Mr. Hubert.

Well, let's get at it this way. You came on at 4 o'clock?

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

You have fixed the earliest time apparently that you could have seen him at 5:30, and the latest at 7:30, which seems that you saw him not sooner than an hour and a half after you came on, and not later than 3 1/2 hours after you came on. Using these relative time measures, does that assist you in fixing the time? For example, would you be willing to state that you did not see Ruby sooner than an hour and a half after you came on duty ?

Mr. Jenkins.

Yes; I think definitely I would state that, because for about the first hour and a half, perhaps even 2 hours, I stayed primarily in the pressroom. I was doing the main part of phone reports to the station, because we had a phone and were trying to keep it, and also we were trying to keep a running account of what was happening. This is strictly now an estimate of time. As I say, I only recall asking the time twice, and I don't ever recall looking at