Mr. Crafard.

I am not sure. I think he was drawing about $300 a month, I am not sure.

Mr. Hubert.

Then there was a man Howard. the maintenance man.

Mr. Crafard.

Howard just got paid, whenever he worked he would get paid, I think a dollar an hour. He didn't work all the time. He might only get 4 or 5 hours a week.

Mr. Griffin.

How much would you estimate in a typical week Ruby took in?

Mr. Crafard.

In a typical week it would be anywhere from one to three thousand.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you know where these twist boards were manufactured?

Mr. Crafard.

They were manufactured in Houston---Fort Worth, I mean.

Mr. Griffin.

What was the name of the company?

Mr. Crafard.

I don't recall the name of the company. I had it wrote down but I don't recall the name of it.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you remember the name of a company called Plastolite Engineering.

Mr. Crafard.

I remember something about it.

Mr. Griffin.

But that wasn't the name of the company that was manufacturing the twist boards?

Mr. Crafard.

It might have been, I am not sure.

Mr. Griffin.

How was Jack trying to sell these twist boards?

Mr. Crafard.

Like I say, he promoted them out at the fair--State Fair, and he had a couple of different stores promoting them, and he had----

Mr. Griffin.

You mean they would be on display some place?

Mr. Crafard.

Yes. And there was some set up, where some of the strippers went out to one place and done the twist on these twist exercisers.

Mr. Griffin.

But to your knowledge he never made a sale on one?

Mr. Crafard.

Not to my knowledge.

Mr. Griffin.

How much would one cost, if you wanted to buy it?

Mr. Crafard.

The way he was selling them I believe it was two something. They were selling them in Texas but it was Penney's, I believe it was Penney's store was selling them.

Mr. Griffin.

In Texas, you mean in Dallas?

Mr. Crafard.

In Dallas. They were selling them for $3.95 apiece, I think it was and he was selling his for $2.95 apiece.

Mr. Griffin.

Did Jack have anybody else associated with him in these twist boards?

Mr. Crafard.

He was trying to get his one brother to do something with them, and I believe it was in Chicago.

Mr. Griffin.

That would have been Hyman?

Mr. Crafard.

How is that?

Mr. Griffin.

That would have been Hyman in Chicago?

Mr. Crafard.

I believe it was "Hy," yes.

Mr. Griffin.

How do you know he was trying to get "Hy" interested in it?

Mr. Crafard.

He had me send some to him.

Mr. Hubert.

I gather from what you have testified to that you have been around carnivals and you have met a lot of people, and also I think you said that you form an impression of an individual pretty quickly and have found in your own experience you have only been wrong once, I think.

Mr. Crafard.

I have been wrong twice that I can recall.
Mr. HUBERT, I would like you to tell us what your impression was of Ruby, and if you can, give us some factual examples and reasons, you know.

Mr. Crafard.

Well, first he was a kind of a likable person He was kind of impressable. I mean he impressed me somewhat. I had one instant feeling, I can't recollect, more or less the way he talked and his actions that the man might be somewhat queer.

Mr. Hubert.

When you say "queer" you mean what?

Mr. Crafard.

As the general usage of the term.

Mr. Hubert.

You mean homosexual?

Mr. Crafard.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

What caused you to feel that?