Mr. Griffin.

How many would you say were there?

Mr. Croy.

I couldn't say. I don't know. There was several there. They were all standing out in here, and when the car came out, everybody had to get out of the way and. let the car get through.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you make any effort to help push the people back?

Mr. Croy.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

As cars went up the ramp and got ahead of you people, what did you do? Mr. CROY. I watched it go up the ramp.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you see it stop at the top of the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

No; I just watched it going up the ramp.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you see the police officer there at the top of the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

Not at that time, I didn't.

Mr. Griffin.

At what point did you lose sight? Where was the car when you lost sight of the car at the top of the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

When he got almost to the top of the ramp, I turned back around. I didn't watch .it drive on out.

Mr. Griffin.

I see. As you looked around, did you see anything of significance?

Mr. Croy.

No.
Mr.. GRIFFIN. Did there come a time when somebody gave you instructions to move the press back against the railing? Mr. CROY. Yes, sir; there was.

Mr. Griffin.

When was that?

Mr. Croy.

Prior to them bringing Oswald down.

Mr. Griffin.

Was that before or after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

It was after.

Mr. Griffin.

Was it any substantial length of time after?

Mr. Croy.

I don't know.

Mr. Griffin.

Now, what makes you sure that it was after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

Because it was just prior to them bringing, just prior to them bringing him out.

Mr. Griffin.

Well, if you were told that, if you were to assume that that car moved out of the ramp, approximately 1 minute before Oswald was shot, would you still feel that this order to move the people back from the railing was

given after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

In other words, you think it could have been as little as, no more than a minute after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

I don't know how long it was.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you feel it was more than a minute after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

You think this order was given more than a minute after the car went up the ramp?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Where was the officer standing who gave that order?

Mr. Croy.

Somewhere in this general area. He just stepped out of the little hallway leading to the jail office. I don't know who it was. He was a detective.

Mr. Griffin.

I see.

Mr. Croy.

In plain clothes.

Mr. Griffin.

You saw him emerge from the jail office?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

He said move everybody back?

Mr. Croy.

Well, he didn't say move everybody back. He said move back against the railing. At that particular time they were all crowded out in here and all the way around.

Mr. Griffin.

You are indicating the area right in front of the TV cameras?

Mr. Croy.

And he said, move the press back against the railing, this group right here. They didn't move them back because they wasn't actually--what