Mr. Paine.

that I drew, I didn't sense that there being another pipe I didn't put it in because I never did place another pipe around it.

Mr. Liebeler.

You never placed another pipe----

Mr. Paine.

I had the idea there might have been more than one pipe here or I didn't know where the other pipe might be.

Mr. Liebeler.

At the time you picked it up, at any time that you picked it up, did you have the idea that there might be more than two pipes inside the package.

Mr. Paine.

Well, I would never have mentioned camping equipment, you see, without, you can't make anything without more than one pipe.

Mr. Liebeler.

Think of the configuration of the package or of the way it acted when you moved it, was there any indication in that sense that there was more than one pipe inside.

Mr. Paine.

No; I think it was a homogenous, that is to say it didn't move one part with respect to another.

Mr. Liebeler.

Was it tied tightly?

Mr. Paine.

It was tied quite firmly. It seemed to me the blanket was wrapped double or something that the blanket itself would have made two pipes trying to hold still in the blanket.

Mr. Liebeler.

How wide was the package?

Mr. Paine.

Well, apparently, it was lopsided because I remember not being able to fit the shovel in it, but if you are to draw that outline or something, I think that would go around the blanket.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you want to draw something additional here?

Mr. Paine.

It was smaller at this end. It was smaller at this one end and that was generally the end that I carried in my right hand.

Mr. Liebeler.

Would you mark the area on the drawing that you are indicating, mark it with an "A" on the drawing. And you indicate that it was smaller at the end marked "A" than at the other end or it was not as wide?

Mr. Paine.

I can't remember how it was wrapped at this end because I could grab my hand around the paper whereas this end, I think was folded over.

Mr. Liebeler.

You say that the blanket, you think the blanket was folded over at the other end opposite from "A"?

Mr. Paine.

Yes; I don't know, there were two separate different thoughts at the time.

Mr. Liebeler.

Now you have drawn a solid line completely around the first drawing that you made on No. 1?

Mr. Paine.

Yes; I don't think I made this one, my solid line should be much longer. It should have gone out there. I will scratch it out.

Mr. Liebeler.

Okay. The witness is scratching out the first line at end "B" and drawing in another line.

Mr. Paine.

This is the widest dimension here, and I was indicating, between 7 and 8 inches.

Mr. Liebeler.

Mark that "C".

Mr. Paine.

All right.

Mr. Liebeler.

Now the witness has stated that the dimension marked "C" on the drawing was approximately 7 or 8 inches. Would you mark a "B" at the end opposite from "A" on the drawing so we can keep the record straight as to what we have been talking about?

Mr. Paine.

[Marking.]

Mr. Liebeler.

We have now gotten two dimensions roughly of the package, the length and the height.

Mr. Paine.

My hand went around it pretty well, It didn't close around it but it went around it to the grabbing of the fashion where the pipe went actually through my fingers and thumb.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did your hand actually close around it?

Mr. Paine.

It did not close around it. At the other end I grabbed it when I picked it up, grabbing it, I will draw my fingers here. This is the thumb.

Mr. Liebeler.

The witness has sketched-----

Mr. Paine.

In that fashion there. That was, say, 2 inches thick with the blanket.

Mr. Liebeler.

Witness has drawn at the end marked "'B" his hand indicating