Mr. Ruby.

down and see Jack, and talk to him before he decided to come in, you know, and take over the case.
I went back to Detroit and in a couple of days I get another call, I get a call, from Woodfield. He is very upset. He just heard some news that he thinks I must know. However, it is so confidential that he can't even tell it to me over the phone. And I talk to Mike Shore and between us--they couldn't tell me on the phone, I had better go back to California.
So, I go out there again. The story he tells me is that, in the meantime he is trying to make contacts, this is about a week later. He is trying to make contact to sell the story to the different publications, to the Saturday Evening Post, you know, and other publications, and somebody from the Saturday Evening Post called him, I think--now this is what he told me and said that Tom Howard was up to the Saturday Evening Post office in Dallas offering for sale a picture of President Kennedy with a piece of his head shot off, and so I immediately, or as soon as I could, when I left them, I called my sister Eva in Dallas and I said, "Get a hold of the agent that has been talking--that has been taking--your story there and tell them about this so they can check into it."
And then I went home, I flew back to Detroit.
By the time I got to Detroit they had tried to contact me to get some more information on the story. I mentioned this to Tom Howard and he denied it.

Mr. Griffin.

Was his denial a flat denial?

Mr. Ruby.

Yes, yes; you know, complete, and you know. However, I think it was the fellow at the Saturday Evening Post that said-- now I have given all this to the special agents or, I think, the Treasury Department.

Mr. Griffin.

Yes.

Mr. Ruby.

The Saturday Evening Post man said, "Well, let them come in front of me in my office and deny it."
But, of course, we never brought it to a head. But, anyhow, I don't know what happened. They never told me, of course, as you know.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you recall the name of the Saturday Evening Post man in Dallas that Howard allegedly contacted.

Mr. Ruby.

No; I did originally but I think I gave it to the agents.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you talk personally to this man from the Saturday Evening Post who claims he talked to Howard?

Mr. Ruby.

No;Woodfield.

Mr. Griffin.

Somebody--you Just reported that somebody said--"Let Howard come before me and deny it."

Mr. Ruby.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

I take it this was the Saturday Evening Post man who allegedly made that statement?

Mr. Ruby.

Let me look in my book. Perhaps I have it.

Mr. Griffin.

What I am getting at is where did you get--who told you--that the Saturday Evening Post man said that?

Mr. Ruby.

Woodfield.

Mr. Griffin.

Woodfield?

Mr. Ruby.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

So everything you know about this transaction between Howard and the Saturday Evening Post comes either from Woodfield or from Howard's denial?

Mr. Ruby.

Yes; right. I don't have it. I may have it somewhere else in another book but I don't have it here.
By the way, if you are asking about the finances, we still have bills of--altogether from what my sister tells me of close to $10,000 that are unpaid now.

Mr. Griffin.

Is there any money left in either of the funds at this point?

Mr. Ruby.

No; I have been putting it off.
I mean, Burleson insists he wants some money so I have been sending him out of my personal account.

Mr. Griffin.

How soon after your brother shot Oswald did you see him?

Mr. Ruby.

I think it was about at least a week.

Mr. Griffin.

Well----