Mr. Senator.

I'll tell you how this sounds to me like unless I'm not reading it. It sounds like I told him that when Jack went to the police office he had Sheba with him. That is the way it sounds to me.

Mr. Griffin.

No; what Agent Moore, I think, is suggesting, at least the way I read it----

Mr. Senator.

You read it. Start with "He said."

Mr. Griffin.

All right, let's read the sentence before that.
"Senator said there were several things that may not have come to the attention of the authorities which would indicate to him that Ruby had not planned to shoot Oswald. He said the fact that Ruby had the dog Sheba to which he was very attached in the car when he went to the police station alone would indicate that he intended to return soon. Also, the fact that he had the cash receipts from the club in the car. Senator said he was convinced that Ruby had emotionally worked himself up to such a pitch that when he saw Oswald in the basement of the police station he went out of his head."
Now as I read those sentences, what you are saying is that if anybody were to learn of all of the facts that took place they should pay particular attention to the fact that Ruby had his dog Sheba in the car when he went to the police station, because that indicates that Ruby intended to come back from the police station before he went down there. Do you still feel that way?

Mr. Senator.

That he intended to come hack?

Mr. Griffin.

That Ruby, if Ruby had intended--are you saying that if Ruby had intended to shoot Oswald before he drove down to the police station, he wouldn't have taken Sheba along?

Mr. Senator.

That isn't what I said.

Mr. Griffin.

That is not what you said?

Mr. Senator.

No. I said I read that like it sounds to me. I must be reading it wrong but it sounds to me like I said he was going to the police station with Sheba.

Mr. Griffin.

No; we understand that you are not saying that at all. What I am asking you is if you mean to say that in your mind Jack Ruby would not have taken Sheba down to the police station with him if Jack Ruby ever intended to shoot Oswald.

Mr. Senator.

I don't think he would; no.

Mr. Griffin.

But do you think he might have anyhow?

Mr. Senator.

I don't know. I couldn't answer that.

Mr. Griffin.

Are you saying now as you think about this further, the fact that he had the dog with him is not an overriding fact in deciding whether Jack had any plan to shoot Oswald before he went down there?

Mr. Senator.

To my knowledge I would say that he had definitely no plans. Now the money part----

Mr. Griffin.

But would you say this, that if Jack Ruby had planned, let's assume for the sake of argument that Jack Ruby planned to kill Oswald before he went down to the police station. Now if Jack had that plan in his mind, are you saying he never would have taken Sheba along with him?

Mr. Senator.

No; I definitely don't think he would ever take the dog with him.

Mr. Griffin.

What would he have done with the dog?

Mr. Senator.

I assume he would have probably, wherever he was going with the dog, maybe he was going to the club or what it is.

Mr. Griffin.

Why do you say that?

Mr. Senator.

What?

Mr. Griffin.

Why do you say that?

Mr. Senator.

Well, all I can say is I know how much he likes that dog, and the dog is always with him, no matter where he goes.

Mr. Griffin.

Is there any reason why Jack----

Mr. Senator.

No particular reason.

Mr. Griffin.

Jack wouldn't figure that you or somebody else wouldn't have picked that dog up later and taken care of it?

Mr. Senator.

I don't know.

Mr. Griffin.

Or isn't it possible that Jack just at this point forgot about the consequences to the dog?