Mr. Griffin.

In other words, they are saying that you couldn't explain why you felt closer to Ruby in this recent period.

Mr. Senator.

If I had just moved in, how could I really feel that closer, just moving in? It doesn't necessarily mean being close to him. I mean, this I don't understand. What do they mean when they say--how can you just move in with somebody and say, Say you are that close to him? You are there, that is true, but what do you mean by .being close to him? If you had just gone in and had always known him casually----

Mr. Griffin.

Isn't part of the reason that you felt closer to him in recent years than you had long before is that you began to live with him in recent years, and that automatically made you closer ? You saw him more often.

Mr. Senator.

Yes; but I mean the way this sort of states to me, unless I misinterpret it, like I just moved in and I am that close to him already, I am really like a buddy-buddy, you know.
.Mr. GRIFFIN. No; there is no mention in here at this point in the FBI interview report of your having moved in with Ruby.

Mr. Senator.

In so many words, though, doesn't it sound the same to you? "...than in the past 3 years".

Mr. Griffin.

Yes; but it doesn't mention that in the past 3 years you moved in and began living with him, whereas before then you hadn't lived with him. As I understand what you have been saying to us up to this point is that your closer relationship simply resulted from the fact that you began to see him every day, whereas before----

Mr. Senator.

See the way I interpret this, the moment I moved in I was already close to him. Of course, I know that I am in the same place, but that is the way I am interpreting it.

Mr. Griffin.

Let's let it stand for the record, then, that you did not automatically feel closer to Jack Ruby at the time you moved in with him.

Mr. Senator.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Your moving in with him was not the result of having established a close relationship, but was a result of Jack's taking you in when you didn't have a place to live and didn't have any money. Is that it?

Mr. Senator.

Yes; I mean the appreciation was there, I want you to know, of these things.

Mr. Griffin.

And how did Jack happen to learn that you needed a place to live and so he invited you in with him?

Mr. Senator.

I identified myself that way.

Mr. Griffin.

In other words, you approached him and asked him if you could move in?

Mr. Senator.

Yes; I don't remember just how it was, but I was not in good condition, I was hurting.

Mr. Griffin.

And had there been something about Jack before that that had indicated to you that Jack would be the kind of a guy who would respond like this?

Mr. Senator.

Yes; because he has responded to other people like this, and after that, and I have seen it.

Mr. Griffin.

Had you heard before you moved in with Jack that Jack had taken in other people or done things for other people?

Mr. Senator.

The example number one is the chap that I told you is deceased--I don't say this man was hurting, but he was still living in Jack's apartment for free.

Mr. Griffin.

Martin Gimpel?

Mr. Senator.

Martin Gimpel. He was still living in Jack's apartment for free. I don't say he was hurting for money, which I don't know because I didn't know his business.

Mr. Griffin.

You knew that at the time you approached Jack? You knew Gimpel had been living with him?

Mr. Senator.

I didn't know Gimpel that way, just from running across him.

Mr. Griffin.

But had anybody else suggested to you that Jack might be willing to take you in?

Mr. Senator.

No, no; it was just one of those things that happened by chance. That is all. Of course, within me I didn't know what was going to happen, but