Mr. Senator.

It never materialized. In other words, look, he had competition because there was one already out.

Mr. Griffin.

Who designed this twistboard?

Mr. Senator.

I think it was manufactured by somebody in, I don't know the name of the place, in Fort Worth.

Mr. Griffin.

Who else was associated with Jack in the twistboard project?

Mr. Senator.

Nobody. This is something that never really got off the ground. See, I think Jack had--what was it--maybe four or five or six dozen of the things. I just don't remember. But it never got off the ground.

Mr. Griffin.

He bought these, and then what was he going to do with them?

Mr. Senator.

He was going to have them manufactured to resell.

Mr. Griffin.

Did he buy them from some place other than Fort Worth, or from Fort Worth?

Mr. Senator.

I am not sure whether he bought them from Fort Worth or some place else. I don't know just where he got them from.

Mr. Griffin.

What kind of material were they made out of?

Mr. Senator.

It was a compressed--I don't know what you would call it--it was a compressed thing. In other words, let me say that it was about this size here.

Mr. Griffin.

You are indicating about a foot long?

Mr. Senator.

Approximately about a foot square.

Mr. Griffin.

A foot square?

Mr. Senator.

Approximately about a foot square, and on the bottom of it--this is a compressed thing. I don't know if you call it a compressed board, or what you call it. There was a compression. Then on the bottom of it it had, I believe, a steel roller with ball bearings in it, on the bottom, so the thing could revolve. Under that was another piece of staple, where it was staple. In other words, it had to hold the weight of an individual

Mr. Griffin.

This was something that you would lean up against?

Mr. Senator.

No, no. It was on the floor, and you just got on it like that, and you go--I am not a good exhibit for a twister.

Mr. Griffin.

In other words, you would stand on this board?

Mr. Senator.

Yes, you would stand on it.

Mr. Griffin.

You wouldn't put it up against your back, or anything?

Mr. Senator.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

You would stand of it?

Mr. Senator.

Strictly stand on it, and it was a novelty.

Mr. Griffin.

And the bottom part would remain stationary?

Mr. Senator.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

And the other part would swivel as you moved on it?

Mr. Senator.

That is right. In other words, instead of going in the twist, this thing did it for you. In other words, you revolved and, of course, this was classified as an exerciser, or something of that nature. As I say, it never got off the ground.

Mr. Griffin.

To your knowledge, nobody else was involved in the promotion of it with Jack?

Mr. Senator.

No; definitely not; no.

Mr. Griffin.

How about John Newman? Do you recognize that name?

Mr. Senator.

John Newman works for the Herald or the Times, the Herald or the News. He works for either the Dallas Morning News--I forgot now--or the Herald.

Mr. Griffin.

How do you happen to know him?

Mr. Senator.

I met him on occasion when Jack used to go up there to place an ad once in a while, when I was living with him in 1962, you know, I went up there with him.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you ever see Newman at the Carousel Club?

Mr. Senator.

I don't know if I have or not. I just don't remember. I couldn't say yes or couldn't say no. I just don't remember.

Mr. Griffin.

I am going to read to you the names that are on Exhibit 5305-R. Bill Petty. Do you recognize that name?

Mr. Senator.

I think I have heard of that name, but don't know who it is.

Mr. Griffin.

Bill Cantrell?