Mr. Senator.

I lived on handouts.

Mr. Hubert.

Tell us about it.

Mr. Senator.

I lived on handouts. When I mentioned these boys here and I was living on handouts with them. In other words, I used to cook for them and wash dishes and things of that nature. I was really depressed, extremely depressed and down and out, and they slipped me five, three, two, whatever it was, and I helped them along in the house there and they kept me for a while.

Mr. Hubert.

You did not pay any part of the rent?

Mr. Senator.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

And that is true for that whole 2 1/2-year period?

Mr. Senator.

It wasn't two and a half. I would say it was approximately a year and a half, to my knowledge. I don't think it was 2 1/2 years.

Mr. Griffin.

You went from Smoler Brothers to Rhea directly?

Mr. Senator.

No, no; I say I had the odd jobs directly.

Mr. Griffin.

Now, how much time was there between Smoler Brothers and Rhea?

Mr. Senator.

I don't think there was much time between them.

Mr. Griffin.

What would you say, 3 months?

Mr. Senator.

It's hard for me to really guess. I'd have to make such a fantastic guess I wouldn't know if I was right or wrong.

Mr. Griffin.

This was not too long ago. This was back in 1957.

Mr. Senator.

Yes, if I told you 3 months I don't know how close I'd be and if I told you 6 months I don't know how far I'd be.

Mr. Griffin.

You say you had odd jobs. Can you be more specific?

Mr. Senator.

Yes, I was with another dress house for a short while, which didn't last too long.

Mr. Griffin.

Doing the same kind of work?

Mr. Senator.

Yes, doing the same kind of work.

Mr. Griffin.

Covering territory?

Mr. Senator.

Yes, they were with a top house. I didn't stay with them long and I wasn't making any money with them.

Mr. Griffin.

What company was that?

Mr. Senator.

Junior Age. I don't believe they are in business any more.

Mr. Griffin.

How long would you say you were with them?

Mr. Senator.

It may have been 3 months. I don't know, 2 months, 4 months. I'm not sure. It wasn't too long.

Mr. Griffin.

Were you on a straight commission with them?

Mr. Senator.

Yes. No, a draw against commission.

Mr. Griffin.

A draw against commission?

Mr. Senator.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

But if you didn't make your draw, you were in the hole with them and had to pay it back supposedly, somehow?

Mr. Senator.

I didn't pay it back, but I was in the hole, yes.

Mr. Griffin.

But after you left this dress house, who did you work for next?

Mr. Senator.

I'm trying to think from the time there until Rhea. I know I did some odd things. I was with Rhea.

Mr. Hubert.

Were these odd things always in the same line, or did you get into other lines?

Mr. Senator.

No. I worked in a little bare place, I think I lasted, I worked there for about 6 weeks once at hardly nothing, just to keep me going.

Mr. Griffin.

Was that in Dallas?

Mr. Senator.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

And that was before you worked for Rhea, or was it?

Mr. Senator.

No. I think that was after. I think that was after I worked for Rhea.

Mr. Hubert.

How long did the Rhea employment last?

Mr. Senator.

I may have been with them maybe a year, year and a half, I'm not sure now.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you make any money off of that?

Mr. Senator.

Just a draw part.

Mr. Hubert.

Were you on the handout basis when you were working for Rhea,