Mr. Graves.

ear; so, he told Leavelle to handcuff himself to Oswald. Can I tell you something off the record?

Mr. Griffin.

Sure.
(Discussion off the record.)

Mr. Griffin.

All right.

Mr. Graves.

I expect it doesn't matter. I thought about it later. It doesn't mean anything, I don't suppose, unless it has some sentimental value to him.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you hear Oswald say anything, or any other conversation with Oswald before you took him down?

Mr. Graves.

I heard some other conversation, but I am vague on what it was. Discussion between he and--I wish I could remember that man's name. I want to say, "O'Malley." Seems like it was an Irish name. He was asking him something about his stay in Russia and some of his activities down in Mexico and--but just what his answer was, I am vague on it. He discussed something with him, and I wasn't paying too much attention at the time. Some answers that he gave.

Mr. Griffin.

Tell us what happened when Oswald went to get something?

Mr. Graves.

We asked him if he would like to put on something. He just had on this white T-shirt, see, and asked him if he would like to put on something. So, when we got these clothes off the rack and started to give him a light-colored jacket or shirt, and said, "If it is all the same to you"--said, "I'd rather wear that black sweater."

Mr. Griffin.

Whose black sweater was that?

Mr. Graves.

Well, his, presumably. So, we let him put it on.

Mr. Griffin.

Where were the clothes?

Mr. Graves.

They were in the captain's office back there in the back, and brought them in there so he could pick out something to wear.

Mr. Griffin.

Were they all his?

Mr. Graves.

Yes, yes; they were. Then----

Mr. Griffin.

Did you help him put his----

Mr. Graves.

I assisted him in putting this on. Then, we, of course, started on out with him. Went on to the elevator, down the hall to what they call the jail office elevator.

Mr. Griffin.

Were you given any instructions as to how you should guard him?

Mr. Graves.

As I said, I was--told to hold to the arm and walk close to him and Montgomery was to walk behind us and Captain Fritz, and Lieutenant Swain in front of us and that is the way we started out to the elevator, and out of the elevator door over to the jail office.

Mr. Griffin.

Was there any discussion about staying close to Oswald?

Mr. Graves.

We were instructed to stay close to him; yes.

Mr. Griffin.

All right, now, was there any discussion about protecting Oswald from other people who'd like to get at him?

Mr. Graves.

Well, to come down and tell us to do that would be elementary, actually, because, I mean, we just know to do that, and our captain knows that we know to do that. So, actually, we weren't specifically told, "Now, you just watch this man and don't let anybody touch him." Or anything like that. We were told that the way would be open and nobody would be interfering with us. Wouldn't be anybody there. All we would have to do was walk to the ear.

Mr. Griffin.

Was there any fear that somebody might come right up in front of him and do something to him?

Mr. Graves.

We didn't have any fear of that because as I said, that--we were told that the security was so that no one would be there but nesmen and officers.

Mr. Griffin.

Now, prior to taking Oswald down to the basement, had you about the threatening telephone calls which the police department had received?

Mr. Graves.

I had not. At that time I didn't know that there had been any threatening calls.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you subsequently lean?