Mr. Hubert.

Of course, as you said, the assistant chief of police and the chief of police, are non-civil service?

Mr. Curry.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Do you still maintain civil service status in the event of a reduction?

Mr. Curry.

In a reduction?

Mr. Hubert.

Yes.

Mr. Curry.

In rank; you are supposed to return to the rank where you were when appointed.

Mr. Hubert.

Now, you, of course, as chief of police, have under you a number of assistant and deputy chiefs of police and then captains of the various divisions and so forth. Who made those appointments?

Mr. Curry.

They are under civil service except for the assistant chief and the deputy chiefs and I make those appointments.

Mr. Hubert.

You made those appointments?

Mr. Curry.

Yes. Now, I didn't make all the appointments, because some of them were in those positions when I was appointed chief. I appointed Batchelor as assistant chief of police and I appointed Fisher, who is in, charge of radio patrol, as deputy chief of police, and I think the rest of them were in their positions when I was made chief and I left them there.

Mr. Hubert.

You had the authority to move them, I take it, but you chose to leave them there?

Mr. Curry.

That's right.

Mr. Hubert.

All right. Now, everybody else was in his position by virtue of civil service?

Mr. Curry.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Now, I would like to direct your attention to the time when the Dallas Police Department first arrested Oswald, and, I assume, became responsible for him and for his security. I believe that it was that he was arrested at the Texas Theatre?

Mr. Curry.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Hubert.

And almost immediately moved to the Dallas Police Department offices ?

Mr. Curry.

So I understand; yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Can you tell us what you know about the matter from that point on, and it may be just as well if you will tell it in a narrative fashion. I will ask you some questions as we go along, or perhaps wait until the end to fill in. We will see how it works out. Briefly, what we want to know is what you know about the whole thing.

Mr. Curry.

Well, on November 22, I was in the lead car of the Presidential caravan. With me were Secret Service Winston Lawson and Forrest Sorrels, and the sheriff of Dallas County, Bill Decker, and we were nearing the triple underpass in the western part of Dallas, and which is near Stemmons Express-way-it was necessary for us to move to Elm Street in order to get on the Stemmons Expressway to get the President's caravan down to the Trade Mart where they were going to have a luncheon.

I heard a sharp report. We were near the railroad yards at this time, and I didn't know--I didn't know exactly where this report came from, whether it was above us or where, but this was followed by two more reports, and at that time I looked in my rear view mirror and I saw some commotion in the President's caravan and realized that probably something was wrong, and it seemed to be speeding up, and about this time a motorcycle officer, I believe it was Officer Chaney rode up beside us and I asked if something happened back there and he said, "Yes," and I said, "Has somebody been shot?" And he said, "I think so." So, I then ordered him to take us to Parkland Hospital which was the nearest hospital, so we took the President's caravan then to Parkland Hospital and they were the President, the Vice President and the Governor--were taken into the hospital and I remained at the hospital for--oh--some hour or so.
At about 1:15 that day--this first incident occurred about 12:30 or so, and about 1:15 I was notified that one of our officers had been shot, and a few minutes later was told that he was dead on arrival at the hospital. At that time we didn't know who shot him. I was just told it was in Oak