Mr. Griffin.

think Ruby, where you saw this man that you believe to be Ruby, moved from and to? Could you show us where?

Mr. Croy.

Do you mean after I told him to move?

Mr. Griffin.

Yes.

Mr. Croy.

I don't know where he moved to.

Mr. Griffin.

Where was he when you first saw him moving? Did you see him moving?

Mr. Croy.

Maybe I don't understand you. As he ran into the crowd ?

Mr. Griffin.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Croy.

After Oswald?

Mr. Griffin.

Yes.

Mr. Croy.

Where did I see. him again? About right .there [pointing].

Mr. Griffin.

Up in front of you?

Mr. Croy.

Yes; well, to my side.

Mr. Griffin.

To your left?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

All right. Would you put a "R" there where you saw him ?

Mr. Croy.

[Makes mark.]

Mr. Griffin.

Now, was there anybody in front of him at that point?

Mr. Croy.

Yes; there was reporters.

Mr. Griffin.

There were reporters. Now, what did he do as he got to these reporters ?

Mr. Croy.

He ran through them.

Mr. Griffin.

Did he push them aside, or what?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you see him push them?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you see a man shoved?

Mr. Croy.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Which man got shoved?

Mr. Croy.

These reporters. He just lowered his head and ran through them like a fullback went through a line.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you feel this man move by you, or did you first see his motion when he was in front of you?

Mr. Croy.

Caught a glimpse of his motion. I have a wide range. I could see over here. I saw a blur coming in, and, of course, by the time I turned, he was in position. He was already in front of me.

Mr. Griffin.

Well, you can't tell from how far he had been running, can you ?

Mr. Croy.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

Were you able to tell if he had taken more than one step before you had seen him ?

Mr. Croy.

He had a good head of steam up, I will put it that way.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you know Captain King?

Mr. Croy.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you know Detective Blackie Harrison?

Mr. Croy.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

Can you describe the people that you saw Ruby push through?

Mr. Croy.

Well, it was just a group of reporters there trying to get closer to Ruby. I mean to Oswald.

Mr. Griffin.

Were there any police officers near Ruby at the time that he moved through that Hue?

Mr. Croy.

There were no uniform police officers. If there were some detectives there, I don't know, because I didn't know any of them.

Mr. Griffin.

Well, during this period that you were down in the basement, the 5-minute period that you were in the basement, were you able to distinguish the plainclothes detectives from the newspaper people?

Mr. Croy.

No; I was in the basement longer than 5 minutes.

Mr. Griffin.

The period that you were stationed at the base of the ramp, the 15 minutes or more, were you able to distinguish the uniformed officers from the newspaper people ?

Mr. Croy.

Uniformed officers; yes The detectives; no.