Mr. Ballen.

appear to me, either by his use of language or any other reference, to be particularly informed, particularly learned, but he did impress me as a man who was going to make up his own mind in this own way, and these tendencies were so pronounced that I felt I didn't want to involve him in my firm, which means a team operation.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did Oswald appear to be a particularly intelligent person or did you form an opinion as to his intelligence?

Mr. Ballen.

I thought he was of above average intelligence, and the unusual thing that struck me as being particularly unusual was the degree to which he would go for self-education and self-improvement. It was this quality--these qualities which attracted him somewhat to me.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did he appear to be in any way mentally unstable?

Mr. Ballen.

Appeared to be just a little too much a hard head.

Mr. Liebeler.

What makes you say that, Mr. Ballen?

Mr. Ballen.

Too much a hard head?

Mr. Liebeler.

Yes, sir; what do you mean by that?

Mr. Ballen.

I--just his general conduct, his general responses, general bearing. He just seemed to be a little too aloof from society, and just seemed to know all things and everything a little too affirmatively, a little too dogmatically, but as far as feeling that he was mentally ill, I didn't come away with that feeling.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember any specific example of his efforts at self- improvement or self-education that you could give us?

Mr. Ballen.

Well, he just indicated a wide range of readership, literature, and the fact that, my impression was one of a little curiosity, a chap out of Fort Worth who would go to the point of reading and becoming familiar with Marxian literature just struck me as someone who was displaying more than the normal amount of initiative.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did you know at that time that he had received Marxian literature?

Mr. Ballen.

Yes; I think I knew even in his offhanded reference to comments on those that he was using Marxian terminology.

Mr. Liebeler.

You think he had Marxian leanings to the extent he understood them to be Marxian leanings?

Mr. Ballen.

I think he considered himself a Marxist, and what exactly his understanding of that philosophy was, I didn't have an opportunity to go into that with him.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember being interviewed by the FBI about December 10, 1963, in connection with your acquaintance with Oswald?

Mr. Ballen.

Was that the FBI or the Secret Service?

Mr. Liebeler.

The Federal Bureau of Investigation, agents Kesler and Mitchell.

Mr. Ballen.

Yes; I recall being interviewed, yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember that he questioned you whether you were familiar or knew of Oswald's Marxist leanings?

Mr. Ballen.

I had a conversation with them pretty much the same as I have been having with you, and I suppose that question came up.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember what your answer was?

Mr. Ballen.

No, sir; I don't remember what my answer was.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you recall that you told the two agents that you were unaware that Oswald had Marxist leanings, and that in a great deal of the conversation Oswald was critical of Russia?

Mr. Ballen.

The difficulty in this thing is in trying to be objective on a conversation which occurred quite some time ago. In reading the newspapers--all I can say in answer to that is, that I am giving the best answer now to my memory and I gave the best answer then, to my memory? I have greater faith in my response today than in December.

Mr. Liebeler.

You are not conscious of any difference in those two answers?

Mr. Ballen.

Oh, yes; I can see that my answer on that day is not the same as my answer here today.

Mr. Liebeler.

Assuming that was your answer that day?