Mr. Ball.

Did he take charge of the hulls there?

Mr. Sims.

I don't know.

Mr. Ball.

Did he take them in his possession, I mean?

Mr. Sims.

I don't remember if he took them in his possession then or not.

Mr. Ball.

But you helped him pick them up?

Mr. Sims.

I picked them up from the floor and he had an envelope there and he held the envelope open.

Mr. Ball.

You didn't take them in your possession, did you?

Mr. Sims.

No, sir; I don't believe I did.

Mr. Ball.

When the rifle was found, were you there?

Mr. Sims.

No, sir; we we still on the sixth floor where the hulls were, I believe.

Mr. Ball.

Did you see anyone pick the rifle up off the floor?

Mr. Sims.

Yes, sir; I believe Lieutenant Day--he dusted the rifle there for fingerprints.

Mr. Ball.

And did you see Fritz do anything?

Mr. Sims.

Yes, sir; he took it and ejected a live round of ammunition out of the rifle.

Mr. Ball.

Do you know who took possession of that live round?

Mr. Sims.

No, sir; I don't.

Mr. Ball.

Now, you left the building about what time?

Mr. Sims.

Well, we arrived at the city hall around 2 o'clock--I'll have to look at the record---on this--about 2:15--we left there evidently about 2 o'clock.

Mr. Ball.

You and who?

Mr. Sims.

Captain Fritz and Boyd.

Mr. Ball.

Then where did you go?

Mr. Sims.

Captain Fritz went over and talked to Sheriff Decker. He sent word he wanted to talk to Captain Fritz, so we talked to the sheriff and then we went to the city hall.

Mr. Ball.

Where was Decker when he said he wanted to talk to Fritz?

Mr. Sims.

Well, I didn't go inside the sheriff's office--I stayed out in the corridor there.

Mr. Ball.

The sheriff's office is just a half a block from the Texas School Depository Building?

Mr. Sims.

Yes, sir; it's across the street.

Mr. Ball.

And the city hall where your office, the police offices are located, is how far from the corner of Elm and Houston?

Mr. Sims.

Well, that's the 500 block there and the city hall is, let's see, in the 2000 block, I believe, so it would be 15 blocks.

Mr. Ball.

A couple of miles--a mile and a half?

Mr. Sims.

I don't know what it is.

Mr. Ball.

When you went back to your offices, was Fritz there at that time?

Mr. Sims.

No, sir; he went back with Boyd and I.

Mr. Ball.

After you left Decker's?

Mr. Sims.

He went back with Boyd and I.

Mr. Ball.

What happened when you went back to your office?

Mr. Sims.

Well, sir; we got to the office and, of course, it was full of people and I think----

Mr. Ball.

You say it was full of people?

Mr. Sims.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Ball.

You mean the floor was full of people?

Mr. Sims.

Our office was--I don't remember about the people.

Mr. Ball.

What people?

Mr. Sims.

Officers--police officers, I don't know who all was up there, all I know is that there was a lot of people.

Mr. Ball.

Had the press moved in and the television cameras at that time?

Mr. Sims.

I don't remember what time they had moved in--I don't remember.

Mr. Ball.

Tell me what happened when you got back?

Mr. Sims.

Well, sir, I think he talked to a detective then--he's a lieutenant now--Captain Fritz talked to Baker and said, "While we was up in the Book Depository Store we heard Officer Tippit had been shot," and so Baker, I believe, told Captain Fritz that they had the man that had shot Officer Tippit, in the interrogation room.