Mr. Surrey.

No, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

What color was it, if you noticed?

Mr. Surrey.

It was either a dark brown or a maroon.

Mr. Jenner.

You followed it awhile and then gave up the chase?

Mr. Surrey.

That is correct. Actually, they made a turn which--I am familiar with downtown Dallas--and they made a turn which would indicate they were doubling back or not going in a straight direction. And I thought perhaps I had been spotted in my convertible. So I left them there.

Mr. Jenner.

I will close, Mr. Chief Justice, by asking the witness--was the Mormon church in session? Had there been----

Mr. Surrey.

There had been services.

Mr. Jenner.

The evening of April 10?

Mr. Surrey.

They were still dispersing.

Mr. Jenner.

When you arrived at approximately 9:30 in the evening of April 10, were people still leaving the Mormon church?

Mr. Surrey.

Yes; they were.

Mr. Jenner.

I have no more questions.

The Chairman.

That will be all, Mr. Surrey. You may be excused now.
The Commission is adjourned.
(Whereupon, at 12:20 p.m., the President's Commission recessed.)

The Chairman.

Thursday, June 18, 1964

Testimony of James J. Rowley

Testimony of Robert Carswell

Testimony of James J. Rowley

The Chairman.

The President's Commission met at 9 a.m., on June 18, 1964, at 200 Maryland Avenue NE., Washington, D.C.
Present were Chief Justice Earl Warren, Chairman; Senator John Sherman Cooper, Representative Hale Boggs, Representative Gerald R. Ford, and Allen W. Dulles, members.
Also present were J. Lee Rankin, general counsel; and Samuel A. Stern, assistant counsel.
James J. Rowley
TESTIMONY OF JAMES J. ROWLEY

The Chairman.

(Members present at this point: Chief Justice Earl Warren. )

The Chairman.

The Commission will come to order.
Chief, it is our procedure to read a little statement as to the purpose of the meeting, for the benefit of the witness.
Chief Rowley will be asked to testify with respect to the protective measures taken by the Secret Service in Dallas, changes in such measures made as a result of the Dallas experience, and with regard to the investigation of the assassination and any information he may have respecting the assassination of the President.
Would you raise your right hand and be sworn?
You solemnly swear the testimony you are about to give before the Commission will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

Mr. Rowley.

I do.

The Chairman.

Will you be seated, please. Mr. Rankin will conduct the examination.

Mr. Rankin.

Mr. Chief Justice, before starting the examination, I would like to make a brief statement for your benefit and for the benefit of the Commission, of the problems that are probably going to develop in this area with regard to the security of the country, and a suggestion about how we might handle them as we proceed with the witness.
I have suggested to Chief Rowley that as he moves along in his testimony he might have various matters that he would think should not be on the record