Mr. Cunningham.

I don't think that a gunsmith would buy the new cases. That is what I was saying. For instance, used .30-.06 brass, right here in town--you can buy it locally. You can buy National Match Cases, which are excellent brass. I think they are a nickel a piece; $5 a hundred.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Are they as good as the new cases?

Mr. Cunningham.

They are once-fired cases. They are excellent.

Mr. Eisenberg.

So in you opinion does the possibility that this discrepancy in bullets and cartridge cases can be explained in terms of reloading make much sense? Does it have a high degree of probability or a low degree of probability, would you think?

Mr. Cunningham.

I am sorry.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Would you think it probable or improbable, in light of all your testimony, that the discrepancy between the number of recovered bullets and the number of recovered cartridge cases can be explained in terms of a reloading operation of some kind, or hand loading?

Mr. Cunningham.

No, sir; I do not. It is improbable, because we found no indication of any reloading operation. And in an examination of all the cartridges that we had examined, there was no indication of a reloading operation on those. They looked like factory bullets and factory cases.

Mr. Eisenberg.

And if you were going to reload, you would use used cartridges rather than new ones?

Mr. Cunningham.

You would use used brass, because you usually can pick it up at ranges and, places like that. You would not even have to buy it.

Representative Boggs.

By that you mean you would use these?

(Referring to Commission Exhibit No. 595.)

Mr. Cunningham.

Yes, sir; well--these would be very difficult--in other--

Mr. Cunningham.

Yes, sir; well--these would be very difficult on account of the case. They would be hard to resize on account of the fact the case is pushed out due to the rechambering. But they could be used; yes, sir.

Mr. Eisenberg.

When you say there is no indication, would there be an indication if they were resized?

Mr. Cunningham.

Yes; usually--unless the sizing die was extremely clean--usually you will get your resizing marks from the resizing die.

Mr. Eisenberg.

And in particular you say the cartridge cases from this particular weapon show a substantial amount of bulge?

Mr. Cunningham.

They do. As you brought to my attention, there is a crack in the one case. I would not care to use this type of brass if I were hand loading. I would find brass that had been fired, in a .38 Special.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Now, by the way, the various cartridge cases, the four cartridge cases and four bullets that you have identified, and that you obtained from your Dallas Office and other sources, that is, Exhibits 594 and 602, 603, 604, and 605, are these now in the same condition as they were when you originally got them?

Mr. Cunningham.

Substantially. A small sample was taken off the noise which was run spectrographically. But the major portions of all these bullets are the same as when they were received in the laboratory.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Did you clean them in any way or alter them?

Mr. Cunningham.

Yes; we had to clean them. They were removed from the body and were bloody. You could not see the surfaces. We had to put them in haemo-sol, which is nothing more than a material that will take out the blood.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Is that true of all four bullets? That is true of the last three bullets as well as the original bullet?

Mr. Cunningham.

Q-13 was cleaned of blood tissue in haemo-sol. I do not think I have anything in the notes that the last three were cleaned at all.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Would that indicate they were not cleaned?

Mr. Cunningham.

I would say so, because I would have put it down.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Was the substance removed from the first bullet tested to see whether it was blood, or did you just assume it was blood?

Mr. Cunningham.

No examination was made of it.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Was there any dirt on the cartridge case?

Mr. Cunningham.

I don't remember any.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Would your notes show if you had cleaned it up?