Mr. Eisenberg.

assassination--that is, exercises conducted with--under noncombat conditions, with a telescopic sight and a rest?

Mr. Simmons.

The only experience that we have with the telescopic sight with which I am familiar is the exercise using this weapon. There have been experiments made using telescopic sights, but these are of limited interest militarily.

Mr. Eisenberg.

In your opinion, what effect does the introduction of a rest and telescopic sight have on probable aiming error?

Mr. Simmons.

From a position where the movement of the weapon is not great, and where the target is slowly moving, the fixed position on the telescope should enhance the probability of a hit.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Do you think a marksman who is less than a highly skilled marksman under those conditions would be able to shoot in the range of 1.2-mil aiming error?

Mr. Simmons.

Obviously considerable experience would have to be in one's background to do so. And with this weapon, I think also considerable experience with this weapon, because of the amount of effort required to work the belt.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Would do what? You mean would improve the accuracy?

Mr. Simmons.

Yes. In our experiments, the pressure to open the bolt was so great that we tended to move the rifle off the target, whereas with greater proficiency this might not have occurred.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Could this experience in operating the bolt be achieved in dry practice, Mr. Simmons?

Mr. Simmons.

Yes; it could be, if sufficient practice were used. There is some indication of the magnitude of change with one of our shooters who in his second attempt fired three-tenths of a second less time than he did in the first.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Mr. Simmons, has data been compiled showing the effect of the time taken between shots on the accuracy of the shots?

Mr. Simmons.

There have been experiments run where aiming error has been measured as a function of the time one has to aim.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Do those experiments show that aiming error is directly proportionate to the length of time one has to aim?

Mr. Simmons.

Not directly proportionate, but aiming error decreases as time increases. But once you get to the area of about 4 seconds in time, then there is very small decrease in aiming error for increase in time.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Translating that to this weapon, does that mean that taking more than 8 seconds between three shots should not appreciably affect the degree of accuracy?

Mr. Simmons.

The 8 seconds I was referring to is between shots.

Mr. Eisenberg.

You said 4 seconds, I thought.

Mr. Simmons.

I beg your pardon.

Mr. Eisenberg.

And I was saying, if you took 4 seconds between the first and second, and 4 seconds between the second and third, for a total of 8 seconds, on the basis of this data would that mean after 8 seconds you would not be substantially increasing your accuracy by taking more time?

Mr. Simmons.

That is correct.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Approximately how many bullets did you fire in the course of your tests?

Mr. Simmons.

We fired 47 bullets.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Did you have any misfires?

Mr. Simmons.

None.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Were you aware when you performed your tests of the conclusions of any other body concerning the accuracy of this weapon?

Mr. Simmons.

No; we were not.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Are you aware of such conclusions at this point?

Mr. Simmons.

No; I am not.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Mr. Chairman?

Mr. Mccloy.

You said that these riflemen, or one or two of them at least, had the rank of master. What is that?

Mr. Simmons.

I again fall back on my comment earlier that I am not a shooter myself. A master is one of the ratings given to highly qualified riflemen