Mr. Kleinman.

I don't recall anything else that I would know. In fact, I have been so darn busy I haven't had time to even read the paper. I have read some of it.

Mr. Griffin.

If there is anything that should come to your attention that you think would be valuable to the Commission, I will appreciate your letting us know.

Mr. Kleinman.

Sometime you hear a lot of different conversations which it doesn't make sense. People form opinions and this and that. It is all foreign to you.

Mr. Griffin.

Have you heard any information of anything about how Jack Ruby got into the basement of the Dallas Police Department on November 24?

Mr. Kleinman.

No; that I didn't. I don't know how he could get in there myself.

Mr. Griffin.

Do you have any information pertaining to anybody who might have given him any assistance or urged him in any way?

Mr. Kleinman.

No.

Mr. Griffin.

Thank you very much. I appreciate your coming here. It was nice to meet you.

Mr. Kleinman.

Nice meeting you.

Wilma May Tice
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Testimony of Wilma May Tice

The testimony of Wilma May Tice was taken at 3:20 p.m., on July 24, 1964 in the office of the U.S. attorney, 301 Post Office Building, Bryan and Ervay Streets, Dallas, Tex., by Mr. Burt W. Griffin assistant counsel of the President's Commission.

Mr. Griffin.

Let me state for the record while Mrs. Tice is here, that I have talked with your husband for a few minutes and I have explained to him that the decision as to whether or not other people are to be in the hearing room with us is the one that the witness makes, and that we have permitted public hearings at the request of the witness, and we have had private hearings at most of these. After I talked with him at some length, I think he agreed with me that if it was your wish that he not be in here, that we go ahead and have this as a private hearing. So I will first of all ask you, Mrs. Tice, if you would like to go ahead privately, or if you would prefer to have your husband in here?

Mrs. Tice.

I would prefer not to have my husband in here.

Mr. Griffin.

Let me introduce myself again. My name is Burt Griffin, and I am a member of the general counsel's staff of the President's Commission on the Assassination of President Kennedy. I want to explain to you preliminarily that what we are doing here and how we are set up and then I will ask you to take the oath and testify.

Mrs. Tice.

Let me ask you first, is this to be told to my husband?

Mr. Griffin.

We will not tell your husband about it, but we are taking a printed transcript and these will all be public records eventually, and it will certainly be available to your husband to read if he should ever want to. Now, if you would prefer not to testify about this, why I think that we are not going to ask you to do it.

Mrs. Tice.

You mean I don't have to testify? I don't have to say anything if I don't want to?

Mr. Griffin.

No; if you would prefer not to testify, why, I am not going to compel you to do it. We asked you to come here because the FBI had interviewed you, and we wanted to get under oath what they had reported to us previously. But as I say, if you have domestic reasons why you don't want to talk about this, we are certainly not going to force you to do it.

Mrs. Tice.

Will I be subpenaed later for something?

Mr. Griffin.

We will not subpena you. The report is in the records.