Mrs. Rich.

Yes; he glared at me and I glared back, as much as to say to each other what the beck are you doing here.

Mr. Hubert.

Had you told the colonel and Dave what your name was prior to that?

Mrs. Rich.

At that time we I think it will be obvious to you gentlemen the reason--we were going under Jack Start and Nancy Starr.

Mr. Hubert.

Do you mean that is the name that Ruby knew you under?

Mrs. Rich.

No. Jack Ruby knew me as Nancy Perrin.

Mr. Hubert.

And he knew your husband was Robert Perrin?

Mrs. Rich.

Yes. But like I say for obvious reasons we used the name Jack and Nancy Starr.

Mr. Hubert.

That is to say, you told the colonel and Dave that your name----

Mrs. Rich.

No; Dave knew our real name.

Mr. Hubert.

The colonel----

Mrs. Rich.

The colonel and everyone else involved, with the exception of Ruby and Dave.

Mr. Hubert.

They knew you as Nancy Start?

Mrs. Rich.

Yes. Also let me state that my husbands' nom de plume as a writer was Jack Starr. I have also published under Nancy Starr.

Mr. Hubert.

All right. What happened?

Mrs. Rich.

Well, they went in and came out and the bulge was gone, and everybody was really happy, and all of a sudden they seemed to be happy. So it was my impression Ruby brought money in.

Mr. Hubert.

They walked out of the apartment?

Mrs. Rich.

Ruby left. He didn't stay. He wasn't there for more than 15 minutes at the most.

Mr. Hubert.

You say all of a sudden the bulge was gone?

Mrs. Rich.

The bulge was gone from Ruby when he left.

Mr. Hubert.

Did he leave the room?

Mrs. Rich.

He left the apartment.

Mr. Hubert.

I mean from the time he came in until he left.

Mrs. Rich.

He came in. To everyone else except my husband and I he said, "Hi." He and the colonel rushed into--I forget whether it was the kitchen or the bedroom. They were in there about 10 minutes. I heard some rather loud undistinguishable words. They closed the door. When they came out everybody looked relieved. And Ruby just walked out.

Mr. Hubert.

And said nothing to you?

Mrs. Rich.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

You say the money was forthcoming?

Mrs. Rich.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you get it?

Mrs. Rich.

No; we didn't. First they had to pay for this pugnacious-looking fellow and one of the Latins who were going down to Mexico to make arrangements and pay for the guns. All of a sudden just before Ruby come in they couldn't go, and right after Ruby left they were on the plane the next morning, so to speak.

Mr. Hubert.

You did not see Jack Ruby hand any money to anybody?

Mrs. Rich.

No; I did not.

Mr. Hubert.

Nor did you see any money handed to anyone else?

Mrs. Rich.

No; I did not.

Mr. Hubert.

So the way it was left then, these people, the others, were going to go to Mexico"-----

Mrs. Rich.

Actually they were going to leave not the day following, but the day after that--2 days later they were going to leave for Mexico. I just assumed that that was money that Ruby brought in. Because before that they could not go, they did not have the finances, and after he left they did.

Mr. Hubert.

Did they say they did not have the finances, or was it your assumption that they did not?

Mrs. Rich.

When someone is stalling around, and not setting a concrete date and saying, "Well, we have to wait" and that it will get here soon, and statements like that that I hear in conversation, then all of a sudden in comes a man with a bulge and hands it to the colonel in. the back room, so to speak, and all of