Mr. Pic.

Where that would have been, I don't remember.

Mr. Jenner.

O.K. But you sort of settled down in 2109 Alvar?

Mr. Pic.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

That your stepfather had purchased that home in 1938?

Mr. Pic.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

And then you went along, he died about a year and a half later after he purchased it.
Take us from the time that your stepfather died and tell us your impressions of how the home life changed; if it did change, what effect, if any, you observed that you now can recall that circumstances had on your mother; and what kind of life you and the boys began to lead as distinguished from the life you led while your stepfather was alive if there is any change now. I don't want to put any words in your mouth.

Mr. Pic.

Well, we were from the time of his death, placed in two boarding schools prior to Bethlehem, this Infant Jesus, and the other one I don't recall the name of, the other one being a day school.

Mr. Jenner.

Sort of a day school, your mother took you in the morning and brought you back. That is two of the boys, not Lee?

Mr. Pic.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

He was almost a suckling child?

Mr. Pic.

I don't remember. I don't see how he could have been there.
Now this day school was prior to Infant Jesus, it had to be. We went to Infant Jesus and out of there back home for a year or so where we attended Washington and then into Bethlehem.
Like I said before, we were constantly reminded we were orphans and had financial difficulty.

Mr. Jenner.

Excuse me, sir; when you just talked about Washington and Bethlehem you put Washington before Bethlehem, and this morning you put Washington into Bethlehem.

Mr. Pic.

No, sir; we went to Washington before Bethlehem.

Mr. Jenner.

I think you will find that the record of this morning, I am pretty sure, will show a different sequence. That is your impression, that you went into Bethlehem a few months after your stepfather died? Mr. PIC. No, sir; Infant Jesus.

Mr. Jenner.

Infant Jesus. I see. Go ahead. You are right.

Mr. Pic.

We were constantly reminded we were orphans and there were financial difficulties, and I was rather young, I don't remember too much about this, but it was always something to do about money problems. We kind of liked Infant Jesus, it wasn't bad at all. We had a pretty good childhood while we lived on Bartholomew Street, there were no major problems there. And even at Bethlehem we beth, Robert and I enjoyed Bethlehem. I mean we were all there with the kids with the same problems, same age groups, and everything. Things for myself became worse when Lee came there, that is why I know he wasn't there too long.

Mr. Jenner.

Tell us about it?

Mr. Pic.

At Bethlehem they had a ruling that if you had a younger brother or sister there and they had bowel movements in their pants the older brothers would clean them up, and they would yank me out of classes in school to go do this and, of course, this peered me very much, and I wasn't but 10 or 9 or 11.

Mr. Jenner.

He was only 3 years old?

Mr. Pic.

Yes; but I was 10. And they did quite a few things like this. If there was an older brother or sister there they had to take care of the younger child. The people there didn't all the time.

Mr. Jenner.

Was this 7-year spread as the years went on between you and Lee, did that affect your relationship with him as distinguished from your relationship with your brother Robert who was only 2 years younger?

Mr. Pic.

Well, anything I was involved in Robert always was. Lee was left out because of the age difference. Robert and I went to all these homes together and all the schools together. Lee didn't, of course.

Mr. Jenner.

During the course of the years your companions and friends, I assume were different, that is you and Robert on the one hand?

Mr. Pic.

Yes, sir.