Mr. Liebeler.

stock the other piece, and the length of the rifle broken down, or the two pieces laid together, would be less also, isn't that correct?

Mr. Alba.

Yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

Because of the tendency to shorten the stock?

Mr. Alba.

But that is not the main motive behind it----

Mr. Liebeler.

No; the motive behind it is to reduce the weight of the rifle?

Mr. Alba.

The weight; yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did Oswald indicate to you whether the weapons that he had or weapon was a military piece, or whether it had been sporterized, or anything about it?

Mr. Alba.

If my memory serves me, he told me he had a few rifles and a few pistols, and never pursued the issue any further to name what they were or what they weren't. I 'don't -know whether it is an assumption on my part or not, and if I am not mistaken he said they were military arms.

Mr. Liebeler.

He didn't indicate whether he sporterized them or not?

Mr. Alba.

No, sir.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did he display familiarity with the whole proposition of sporterizing a rifle?

Mr. Alba.

No; he didn't.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did he display, or did you draw any conclusions as to whether he was familiar with this process or not?

Mr. Alba.

No. And yes; I would say that I had drawn an opinion that he was not familiar with the sporterizing of arms.

Mr. Liebeler.

Do you remember any other conversations that you and Oswald had about rifles or weapons?

Mr. Alba.

None other than he asking permission to borrow some magazines from time to time. And as far as I knew, they were all returned.

Mr. Liebeler.

What kind of magazines were these?

Mr. Alba.

Outdoor Life and Field and Stream, Argosy, and hunting and fishing magazines, and National Rifle Association magazines. And guns and ammo magazines.

Mr. Liebeler.

Did he ever have discussions with you about the relative merits of a small calibre as opposed to large calibre bullets?

Mr. Alba.

None.

Mr. Liebeler.

You are very clear about that in your mind?

Mr. Alba.

We discussed the wounding effect of combat guns of the small calibre versus the large calibres, yes.

Mr. Liebeler.

What was that discussion?

Mr. Alba.

Well, the small calibre in the field would tend to disable a man and require-two men to cart him off, versus the larger calibre which would knock out a man permanently.

Mr. Liebeler.

I am looking at an FBI report which indicates that on November 25, 1963, you were interviewed by two agents of the FBI, Mr. Lester G. Davis, and John William Miller.

Mr. Alba.

I remember that.

Mr. Liebeler.

And the report indicates that you recalled an additional conversation that you had with Oswald in which you and Oswald discussed the merits of small calibres and larger calibre bullets, and the report said that you recall that Oswald mentioned that a small calibre bullet was more deadly than the larger one, to which point you agreed.

Mr. Alba.

Having been left with a wounding effect you would survive a larger calibre wound, your chances of survival from a larger or large calibre wound would be greater than the smaller calibre. We went into the discussion of basing the thing in the ice pick versus the bread knife I don't think I mentioned this part to the FBI--reflecting-on the whole picture that you would be better off receiving a wound from a 10-inch bread knife than you would be being gigged once with a 2- or 3-inch ice pick, and that reflecting the difference between the large calibre wound and the small calibre wound.

Mr. Liebeler.

What led you and Oswald to agree that you would be better off being hit with a bread knife than with the ice pick?

Mr. Alba.

Internal bleeding.

Mr. Liebeler.

There would be more internal bleeding from the ice pick?