Mr. Jenner.

(Discussion between Counsel Jenner and the witness, Mrs. Cunningham, off the record.)

Mr. Jenner.

Now, I think we had better be on the record on this.

Mrs. Cunningham.

None of our tests are personality tests.

Mr. Jenner.

You see, I want you to tell me what these are, and if I misinterpret them, I want you to correct me. It is important that we know what testing was done and that we don't misinterpret it ourselves.
Now, is any of this a personality test?

Mrs. Cunningham.

No, sir; none whatsoever. It is aptitude--it is an interest checklist and I am an employment counselor only, and that is why you got part of the answers from me a while ago, was that I was limiting it to that segment of counseling which presumably is my specialty, and for which I am paid by the Texas Employment Commission.
In general, I would say that the tests indicate potential for quite a broad number of jobs---certainly in the semiskilled and skilled occupations.

Mr. Jenner.

Would these be a potential with training?

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes, sir. Certainly I have indicated the areas in the clerical field by the tests that I selected and most of the drafting jobs, of course, are semiprofessional. I did not apparently think that these others were important at the time or I would have given other classifications.

Mr. Jenner.

Other classification tests?

Mrs. Cunningham.

No, sir; I'm sorry--I am throwing you on terminology.
This indicates where the application is held.

Mr. Jenner.

Would you tell us what you mean by "this"?

Mrs. Cunningham.

The words "Routine Clerical Work---1-X-4.9" is a classification of the application in the area where the application will be held by the placement interviewers for referral on jobs.

Mr. Jenner.

This represents an entry based on your judgment in interviewing?

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

And that is your personal entry and your handwriting?

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

And what does that job classification mean and what degree of aptitude, if any, does it indicate?

Mrs. Cunningham.

On the entry level.

Mr. Jenner.

Just the entry level?

Mrs. Cunningham.

Into routine clerical work--it covers a lot of jobs and a lot of work circumstances.

Mr. Jenner.

Now, I ask you this--there is a surface inconsistency between that particular classification you gave him and your testimony with respect to his capabilities to do college work. I say there is a surface inconsistency, would you explain that?

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes, sir. To enter professional jobs, usually the employers require more training or experience in the area of the profession. The availability in this labor market of clerical jobs to a newcomer into the labor market area is very much greater and, therefore, the job opportunities for this young man in a clerical entry job would be much brighter than in an entry for a professional Job.

Mr. Jenner.

So, I take it, then, in that classification as dictated by your knowledge of the available labor market, this was an area which at the time seemed to afford greater opportunity for placement of this young man immediately.

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner.

Having in mind the information related to you by Mr. Meller, that there was dire need for financial assistance here.

Mrs. Cunningham.

Yes.

Mr. Jenner.

And the other aptitudes you recorded on his ability you thought to do college work--those are not inconsistent with the classification you gave when you considered the whole problem that was facing you at the immediate time.

Mrs. Cunningham.

Then I was talking about the potential only for the future, he had not even started college--a-college training, by the record as I